Ridiculous... seriously

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tornasunder
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Ridiculous... seriously

Post by tornasunder »

While it might not be my place to say anything... but I find it pretty infuriating to see people show up to raids that aren't at least in 66 gear... 69 gear would be better but, let's just say 66 for the sake of this post. When you do show up to a raid in anything less, to me, it shows that you don't care about trying and are just wanting the guild to carry you. Likewise, showing up without stims is also pretty silly... if you signed up to go to the raid, you've made a commitment (of sorts) to be there, you should already know that you need them. The raiding guild that I ran, we had a motto ... "Repaired, Prepared, and On Time"... which meant that if you showed up without meeting all 3 of the requirements, you lost your spot for that night. Sure, there were nights where I called raids because people couldn't be bothered to take it seriously... but overall, people came to realize that just as they thought their time was valuable to them... other people's time were valuable to them as well. I'm not a huge fan of wiping for 90 minutes on bosses that we (as a guild) have on farm. It's truly a slap in the face to the people who have worked their a$$ off to run FP's for their gear.
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Skyleth
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Re: Ridiculous... seriously

Post by Skyleth »

reqs

If you are signing up for stuff and do not come close to meeting these reqs on an 8 man, especially DF/DP SM you are wasting people's time. That is unacceptable.

The post is for HM but it holds true regardless. If you are not at a minimum in augmented 66's (which you can get from the oricon quest line) with UP TO DATE relics, you are hurting not helping.

Guild 16m is a little different due to the fact that we can bring some of our hugely overpowered mains to more than make up the difference so that more people can participate. For 8m though it is unacceptable.

I'm busy so that is all I will say.
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Alystri
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Re: Ridiculous... seriously

Post by Alystri »

Anyone that wants help to gear up I am willing and there are a lot of other people willing to help. I ran a ton of fps to gear up. I know it sucks sometimes to wait in the queque for an hour to do a FP. But that is what you have to do. Or just run Oricon.

If the guild wanted to sponsor a gearing FP night or Oricon night I would be willing to help. I know at one point we did fps on Mon.

I have really enjoyed raiding with the guild. But it took a lot of effort to get to the point where I am. For those that remember when I joined the guild, I did not know anything, seriously. I had never played an mmo and I was really bad (I'm not saying I'm awesome now, but I can hold my own :)). I still ask a lot of questions and advice of the more experienced players.

Posting for help and asking people who knew more than me helped me significantly. Everyone was very helpful and I did not feel like anyone did not want to help.

It is common courtesy to take a raid seriously. I felt bad a few weeks ago when we wiped for an entire week on a boss we had cleared before. While I did not blame others, I began to wonder if it was my fault and started parsing more and even considered respecc'ing. I did this because I never want it to be my fault that the raid fails.

I agree with sky that this is mainly for hm, but even for sm it is pretty easy to get 69 gear. If everyone gears up before we known it we will be able to do 16 man hm.

I think that most people are gearing up really well. I am starting to feel pressure to step up my game a notch, becuase I can see that we are getting a group of solid players. That is making the hm progression group kind of a competition to get a slot. That is healthy. It helps all of us to not get lazy.

Anyways, that is my two cents,


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Re: Ridiculous... seriously

Post by Intisar »

Last night was frustrating so It's important to remind everyone to take a hard look at their gear before signing up for Operations. Everyone needs to do their part especially at the 8 man level. Story mode operations are forgiving and welcoming to folks who don't play seriously, but they are a step up from flashpoints, and Dread Fortress and Dread Palace where we spend most of our time are a step up from Scum and Villainy and Terror From Beyond. The recommended gear rating for DF is 156, or purple 66 level mods. Simply by completing the Oricon quest chain, you'll have 156 armor pieces in every major slot, so it's not an onerous standard to meet. The rest can be filled out by doing a few Hard Mode flashpoints and the some 55 weekly quest chains. If the rest of your gear is not up to that level, let me offer some tips for upgrades:

I suggest investing in a 72 main hand hilt or barrel as soon as you hit 55, but if you can't afford them, the guild bank is stocked with 66 versions which are free for the taking. Don't be shy about grabbing upgrades. That's what they're there for. 162 quality earpieces and implants can be crafted by Cybertechs and Biochemists and I know many of the patterns. As for relics, if you like PVP you can get good starter relics at the Conqueror level from the Warzone Comms vendor, and you can get great relics at the Oboran level with ranked comms. If you prefer not to PVP, the basic comms vendor sells Arkanian relics. In addition Zyera can craft the Underworld Relic of Serendipitous Assault which is well worth the investment for any dps or healer.

There are Bind on Equip 156 quality epics on the GTN for odd ball slots like belts, bracers, implants and ears as well so be sure check that out. The GTN is always stocked with stims, so make sure you grab one or two before leaving Fleet.

I recommend everyone's first Elite Commendation (and later Ultimate Comm) purchase be an off-hand. After the main-hand, the off-hand will give the biggest bump to your power.

Lastly, I cannot recommend augmenting every slot highly enough. Even with blue augments, you get nearly 400 extra stat points. That's like wearing an second belt AND bracers. The bonus is considerable and worth every credit. I know crafting or buying augment kits is a pain, but it makes a dramatic difference and that's why everyone who wants to do Operations really, really should do it.

What I love most about NOR is that we do Ops at an loose, informal and friendly pace. But we do the Ops to see the story and have fun; it should not be for anyone the quickest path to epic lootz. It's the most fun when everyone comes prepared and does their part to the best of their ability. If you're worried you're not up to snuff, ask an officer, any of us will gladly offer advice.

Going forward, however, folks should understand that a few players being disappointed that they were asked to sit out because they are not prepared is far better than an entire group of eight ending a night in frustration.
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Re: Ridiculous... seriously

Post by Tundrra »

This has started an officer/DMG email discussion and I’m sure we will see some changes that will be announced soon.

Wiping a lot on a Raid is no fun and frustrating that I understand. However I want to point out a couple things.

As many of you know our Sith side branch is still pretty new where Raiding is concerned. It has grown very quickly over the last couple months. Up until now we have had just barely enough players for a 8player OP, how many weeks ago did we have to call a raid due to not enough players?

At this time Sith side has been casual raiding where anyone lvl 55 can come. It has been the same players and they have moved up to DF/DP quickly, however no one has requested or posted that it has turned into progression raiding. Progression posted raids is the only place where we currently have strict minimum requirements. All others raids so far have been very casual requiremts of being lvl 55 to come join the fun. The zones for these types of raids should be based on who sign up, sometimes you have to throw in a SV/TFB night, just like we did on Thursdays Nights in Nov and Dec.

I think we have reached a point on the sith side where we need to have multiple raids just like we do on republic. One where we can introduce new Raiders to Ops, so they can learn the techniques and gear more quickly and a second one that continue their Progression that they have been working on the past few months. Up until now we haven't had enough players sith side to be able to turn folks away or add an additional night of raids. As we grow we need to cater to the full range of our players abilities so that we can continue to grow and have players transition from one tier to the next. This is what we have done pub side and I think it will work just as well sith side.
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Re: Ridiculous... seriously

Post by Tundrra »

This is what is currently posted at the top of every sith raid signup:
Raid Destination will be based on those that attend, currently scheduling T3 & T4 OPs

Be sure to check the 2014 Schedule for additonal Raids/Operations & Events!
I was some what wrong on the requirements, this is what we have currently posted on what our current min requirements for T3.
Tier 3 OP:
Requirements:
Level: 55
Equipped Gear:
Gear should be Level 63, Armor Rating 150+
Augments: All 14 of your gear pieces should have Augments.
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Re: Ridiculous... seriously

Post by Zyera »

I can make relics, augments and kits.

I have a Cybertech that can pop out Kits like no other because she can make Droid parts that only take 2/2/2 (gimme some metal and I can easily make some kits!)

I also can make stims- I will pump some out and have extras on my raiding toons.

If you are a healer- Let Int, myself or Valikk know! We can help! :D

& Valikk is knowledgeable of Tanks and Gunslingers as well.


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Re: Ridiculous... seriously

Post by Zyera »

Tundrra wrote:This has started an officer/DMG email discussion and I’m sure we will see some changes that will be announced soon.

Wiping a lot on a Raid is no fun and frustrating that I understand. However I want to point out a couple things.

As many of you know our Sith side branch is still pretty new where Raiding is concerned. It has grown very quickly over the last couple months. Up until now we have had just barely enough players for a 8player OP, how many weeks ago did we have to call a raid due to not enough players?

At this time Sith side has been casual raiding where anyone lvl 55 can come. It has been the same players and they have moved up to DF/DP quickly, however no one has requested or posted that it has turned into progression raiding. Progression posted raids is the only place where we currently have strict minimum requirements. All others raids so far have been very casual requiremts of being lvl 55 to come join the fun. The zones for these types of raids should be based on who sign up, sometimes you have to throw in a SV/TFB night, just like we did on Thursdays Nights in Nov and Dec.

I think we have reached a point on the sith side where we need to have multiple raids just like we do on republic. One where we can introduce new Raiders to Ops, so they can learn the techniques and gear more quickly and a second one that continue their Progression that they have been working on the past few months. Up until now we haven't had enough players sith side to be able to turn folks away or add an additional night of raids. As we grow we need to cater to the full range of our players abilities so that we can continue to grow and have players transition from one tier to the next. This is what we have done pub side and I think it will work just as well sith side.

I agree. For the longest of times we just did what we could with the people we had now we had about 10 people sign up. That's great! But it means that some are geared and some are not.

I agree we might have to think about changing raid schedules around, one for higher tier and one for lower.
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Re: Ridiculous... seriously

Post by Briennia »

I totally acknowledge the frustrations that were voiced here, but I'd like to give a slightly different perspective if I may.

I'll say at the outset that I was an experienced raider in WoW, but I am new to the SWTOR raid content. I met the gear requirements, and I did show up as Torn says, Repaired, Prepared, and On Time (totally great motto, btw). I point these things out not because I want to talk about how awesomesauce I am, but just so the intent of my post is clear. I didn't take any of what has been posted personally, and I am not posting here to defend myself. I understand the frustrations that come with endgame raiding.

This is my second Wednesday night raid with NOR. On the first, we cruised through the 8 man with very little problem. It was very fun, and we totally crushed the content. It was great fun. Everyone was very welcoming and clearly having fun on TS and in the raid.

Last night, we had more difficulty with the content, but we did down two bosses. Yes, wiping is frustrating and sometimes hard to explain.

However, the same fun, welcoming atmosphere was present on TS, in chat, and among the guild members. As a new recruit, FWIW, that meant more to me than boss kills. I understood from the outset that this was a casual raid, which was taking basically any 55.

If I understand the situation correctly, Intisar was tanking the raid for the first time on Galan'dara, and he learned that he was leading it about ten minutes before the raid started. It was my second time there, and I know some others were also new either to the instance or to their roles. I do not believe expecting clockwork boss kills from this particular raid makeup was reasonable, and I certainly didn't expect it. Although the guild may have these bosses on farm in general on the Republic side, this was not NOR's front line experienced, geared raid group.

I completely understand the frustrations everyone has voiced here -- I have shared them at times when I was a guild officer doing endgame raiding. While this raid may have shared trends with some of the issues confronting NOR's advancement raids -- I don't know if it does or not -- I do not think this particular evening, on a casual raid with alts, newbies, and a last-minute raid lead should be taken as an indicator of player interest, ability or collective guild strength. This was far from an advancement raid.

/shrug

My two cents, probably not worth even that.
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Re: Ridiculous... seriously

Post by Tundrra »

Briennia wrote: My two cents, probably not worth even that.

Totally worth it thanks Briennia!
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